Piro Tuning (Spirit Pro)

[Heliman450]

Hi Steve, it does have the 600 boom and was always a bit tail heavy even with its original 550 boom. This time, I fitted the shorter tail rotor blades (85 mm not 90 mm) rather than the longer ones from previously. I've also done some calcs to find out what percentage I need on the throttle to give the equivalent tail rotor speed with the higher gear ratio. With zero pitch it needs 83% throttle just to achieve the same revs on the tail. Therefore, it will need probably up to 100% when load comes on with higher pitch demand.

By any chance do you have the dimensions of the bigger landing gear? I was also considering something along those lines but don't have access to one to take the measurements. My local supplier is stocking fewer big heli parts as their business is migrating towards Rc-Cars. I would be inclined to go for a complete switch rather than only the rear so that the heli maintains a level stance on the ground. I suppose it doesn't matter too much for you guys who just lift off into the wide blue yonder and perform magic

 

[Smoggie]

I run 105mm tail blades on my 600 to try to get tail authority back due to the low ratio. The 600 comes with 95mm tail blades so you could try those.

I'll measure the landing gear and let you know. The other option is fitting the longer tail skid from the 700 which fits straight onto the 550/600 tail box. I used to have the 700 skid fitted but i found the landing gear mod worked better in keeping the blades out of the dirt.

 

[Heliman450]

I run 105mm tail blades on my 600 to try to get tail authority back due to the low ratio. The 600 comes with 95mm tail blades so you could try those.

I'll measure the landing gear and let you know. The other option is fitting the longer tail skid from the 700 which fits straight onto the 550/600 tail box. I used to have the 700 skid fitted but i found the landing gear mod worked better in keeping the blades out of the dirt.

Hi Steve, by 'skid' I assume you mean the vertical tail fin. I'd actually feel better with a shorter tail fin as the original is only 7 mm from the deck. This was the reason that I destroyed the gear train as the fin bent and hit the tail rotor blades during a rather heavy landing onto the slight incline down to the take-off pad. Hopefully something to avoid anyway in future but no reason not to tackle the potential problem if I'm doing some mods.

I can think of a number of ways to jack up the body, but the only issue to resolve is really the canopy fixing point, which must be the same as the clip fixes to the chassis plate and the front bracket. If other landing gear will be a straight swap, then I reckon that's the way to go.

 

[Heliman450]

Hi all, a quick update is that this morning, my test hover went perfectly and I burned up a battery checking out the helis ability (and mine ) to take-off/land without the tail being destroyed.

One thing of note, is that due to the uneven surface of the heli pad, the tail was actually resting on the ground before the take-off. I'm still interested in the possibility of jacking the body up so any feedback on the best way to achieve it are most appreciated.

Final point, my flying club has a couple of events today/tomorrow so I probably won't be able to contribute until Monday onwards.

Bye now!

 

[Smoggie]

Phil,

Sorry for not getting back on the dimensions, it slipped my mind. I'll measure the landing gear up in the morning.. And yes i meant the tail fin and you are right that the 700 one would probably drag on the deck with the stock landing gear.

 

[Heliman450]

Phil,

Sorry for not getting back on the dimensions, it slipped my mind. I'll measure the landing gear up in the morning.. And yes i meant the tail fin and you are right that the 700 one would probably drag on the deck with the stock landing gear.

Hi Steve, thanks very much for that. I'm sure it will prove interesting, if not a straight forward solution, then maybe with less mods than I've been considering up to now.

Back to the field very soon. Yesterday's event went very well but got absolutely washed out (as Weather Pro predicted ). It's already raining now and expected to last through until tomorrow, too.

 

[Smoggie]

Phil,

I've measured up the landing gear:

• Trex 600 Pro/L landing gear (H70060): Width = 199mm, height (to centre of skid pipe) = 46mm
• Trex 700e Landing gear (non-F3C) (H70059T): Width = 199mm, height = 55mm

I think (but not 100% sure) that the 550 uses the same landing gear as the 700e (H70059T), so in this case the fix for lifting the tail would be to fit the lower profile Trex 600 Pro gear (H70060) at the front.

Note that some versions of the 700e use the low profile (F3C) landing gear from the 600 Pro, so you need to make sure you get the correct part numbers.

Here's my 600 pro, I'm holding the low profile 600 landing gear next to the rear legs where I've got fitted longer the 700e gear:

 

[Heliman450]

Hi Steve, that's looking great and thanks for the part numbers and dimensions.

We managed to do the event today as the weather changed just as our guests began arriving and lasted long enough for the guys to do some flying, eating and drinking as well as tearing down the two marquis before the storm broke!

Yesterday evening, one of the guys shot some amazing video footage with his drone. He's passing the files to me soon to do some editing. Keep an eye out for the production

 

[Heliman450]

Latest update.....................

Oh dear, oh dear! Another main gear and and tail gears needed. The maiden post assembly went well, if not for long due to time constraints (2 batteries worth). I then took the opportunity to run through the setting up of my new ESC and deactivated it again afterwards in the Spirit Pro. My next maiden should have been no issue, however, the heli lifted majestically off the ground into a hover and almost immediately flew itself sideways into the long grass and the motor didn't respond to the stick or the throttle hold. Fortunately no injuries as it went sideways and our field is remote enough to not endanger others.

I'm going to the store this morning to purchase another set of gears (main blades, too). Any suggestions as to what it might have been will be useful in my investigations.

This tragedy is getting off topic, so I'll post a link to somewhere else when I decide the best location.

Bye all!

 

[Smoggie]

Sorry to hear about the crash. It sounds like you had no control which would suggest some sort of radio issue?

 

[Heliman450]

Hi all! I decided where to carry on this particular thread as it's developed from the original title. It's still related, as I suffer the damage of my heli through my practising and turning the virtual simulator exercises into real-world action.

T-Rex Parts Listings

Remember, I don't have any other resource for expertise apart from Rc-Help.com, otherwise I have to pay about $70 per hour for someone to do things for me here in Switzerland. This is a price I don't want to pay and up to now, for me, the most enjoyment comes from learning the hobby in all its aspects other than simply just flying! Time I've got plenty of, money just took a major hit with the U.K.'s Brexit decision last week. Even without the initial slump it cost almost 25k CHF in our cash so maybe my wish to build a scale turbine heli just took a fatal crash.

Let's hope that the U.K. political leadership can come up with a future that really is brighter for the Pound than being in the E.U.

 

[Heliman450]

Sorry to hear about the crash. It sounds like you had no control which would suggest some sort of radio issue?

Hi Steve, yes I agree. I managed to buy the new parts (again) and when I'm done with the repair, I'm going to investigate why. I hate to be in the dark on something like this.

I'm going down the road of investigating any conflict with what I did in the governor area of the Spirit Pro software causing problems with the ESC. Can't guess at it yet, so anything you can come up with is more than welcome.

 

[Tony]

Don't worry about getting help here on this site, we will always do what we can.

do you want me or one of the other mods to close this thread?

 

[Heliman450]

Don't worry about getting help here on this site, we will always do what we can.

do you want me or one of the other mods to close this thread?

Hi Tony, hope all's well with you. No reason to mention anything, I know exactly what value the site has.

Steve and I have been getting on like old style pen friends recently and I'm sure he can deal with anything I can't find out for myself. The Spirit website forum works too slow for responses and up to now have only provided low-level feedback so I'm better finding out for myself with Steve's experience with all things other than Spirit. It's also the Jeti TX that comes into the equation, so of course viewers are also seeing the feedback. All to the good, hey?

All the best and nice to hear from you again!

 

[Smoggie]

Can't guess at it yet, so anything you can come up with is more than welcome.

Phil,

I'm struggling to come with with a sensible explanation other than maybe an issue with the power supply to the receiver and FBL.. But that really shouldn't be an issue because your Hobbywing ESC has an excellent internal BEC that has more than ample power rating.

It's hard to figure how any issue with the FBL setup or the ESC would simultaneously cause loss of control of both cyclics (causing heli to drift uncontrollably) and power (meaning throttle hold didnt work). On the fact of it that suggests loss of reception, plus the failsafe not being set.

By the way....You should have the failsafe set so that power cuts on loss of reception, that can be set in the Spirit and probably in your receiver too.

Only thing i can suggest is to do a very thorough range check and also a stress test of the BEC prior to flying again. The Spirit software has a 'BEC tester' in the diagnostics tab of the software.. Basically this just causes all the servos to cycle at full speed which puts the BEC under high load... It's quite violent!

 

[Heliman450]

Hi Steve, sounds like good stuff to get the diagnostic juices flowing. I'm expecting to re-build the tail during this week and hopefully get straight into the Jeti/Spirit Pro with a bit of luck. We just dismantled our office area and set it up on the dining table so I'm under pressure to carry out the mods and paint it first. This morning we're going to buy some stuff from the local DIY store.

Cheers and chill out on my thread for now. I'll get back to you soonest.

 

[Heliman450]

Hi all, latest update is that the tail is newly rebuilt, the Spirit Pro checked through and a successful test hover done (one full battery, plus about three-quarters left from the bench testing). A video is available if needed.

Steve, it looks to have been the fail-safe and possibly a problem with the reception, although I can't say that for sure. The heli was only about 8m from me at the time and I haven't found any loose connections during my checks. If I'm critical, I'd say that the power connection from the new ESC to the Spirit Pro isn't as tight as I'd like so maybe that's an intermittent fault. There is also a second supply from the ESC to the receiver, which supplies the Spirit Pro via the EX-Bus connection, so that should cover it.

I don't have any spare connectors to change the original, maybe an extension would help by giving a better link to the ESC than direct into the Spirit Pro? During my shopping trips I've never found a servo connections kit. I don't like untidy cables in any form, so it's on my list for the future.

Back to the field.

Bye for now!

 

[Heliman450]

During my re-build, I managed to make use of my digital calliper along with its new attachments for checking the links. Great new addition to my tool kit

Digital Caliper

 

[Smoggie]

Phil, I stumbled accross a thread elsewhere where a Trex 550e owner had done just what I talked about with the landing gear, i.e. fitted the shorter F3C gear at the front and the stock 'long' 550 gear at the back. This kicks the tail up quite nicely and creates some useful tail rotor clearance. here's a photo of his heli:

 

[Heliman450]

Hi Steve, hey, that looks really good. The change achieves the tail fin lift to keep it well clear of the ground. Even though my landings are very gentle, there's still a slight touch that shows on the new tail after only about 10 landings. My concern lies with its likelihood to lift-off forwards and not straight up. I've bought some bits and pieces to give about 20 mm lift to both front and back but I'm sure it won't look quite so cool.

I notice that it's also fitted with the curved tail-fin and a DFC rotor head. Do you think a change to the DFC is worth it when the time comes for an overhaul? I did some checks on battery use and I reckon to have flown a little over 3 hours since buying it second hand. That works out at around 400k revolutions. If I'm critical, I don't think the main bearings are quite so good. I'll use the vibration check facility in the Spirit Pro before making any final decision on that though. The tail's running sweet as a nut now.

I'm off to the field again tomorrow morning to carry on with my practice. The whole field has had the grass cut and I gave the heli area a good trimming so it now looks much better than before. As far as I can find out there are only three of us in the club use it.

Bye now, back to the Wales/Portugal game.