600 Derek's Align Trex 600e Pro DFC

Derek

Well-Known Member
I got the same reading for my Goblin. 57% TX at 45% in the soft ware.
I have mine set to 45% on the TX and it flies perfectly.
You have three pos for gyro. I would set one at 45%, one at 35% and one at 27%.
Start with the lower one, and work up till you find the best.

I can flip the Gyro switch on my DX8 but it's not an active switch. I went to the Switch Select and tried to enable it but I can only enable Aux 2 and Aux 3. I have the Aux 2 set to my Aux switch to allow me to switch between each bank but I can't seem to get the Gyro switch to work.

Any suggestions on this?
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
I have my gyro mixed to my Flight mode switch. So as I flip to a higher head speed, my Tail Gain % is reduced.
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
I have my gyro mixed to my Flight mode switch. So as I flip to a higher head speed, my Tail Gain % is reduced.

ok, that's how I have mine. I was just hoping there was a way to use my Gyro switch to have 3 different gains set. Nonetheless, I think my 600 is ready to go. Batteries are charged and I'm loading up my truck now.
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
Ok, I have some good news and bad news about todays flights.

The good news is that I did maiden the 600 and it went super well. No flying, just hovering but it was super solid and very easy to maneuver. I was very nervous about the hover attempt until it got off the ground and I was moving it around. It didn't take me long to calm down a bit but I was all smiles. What an awesome experience!!!

Off topic, I flew my 500 today, twice, and I did some flips, rolls, tic tocs, loops, and landed it softly. Just awesome!

I do have video of both flights but I can't get them uploaded until tomorrow. My home PC is still in my daughters room and she is asleep for the night. I'll surely get the videos uploaded tomorrow.

The bad news of it all...the hover attempt of the 600 was just that. Just hovering. I had my timer set for 2 minutes. After my timer went off, I was able to land the helicopter with ease but the motor was HOT!!! Too hot to hold my hand on it. I can't imagine that this is a good thing. I was only running 30% throttle and the motor was HOT!

Does this mean that I need a new motor or is there something else that I need to be looking at?

All in all...it was an awesome day of flying and the wife is very proud of me, lol.
 

pvolcko

Well-Known Member
30% throttle hovered it? These motors cool themselves based on rpms and the force of the cuts in the can pulling air through the core. By running at 30pct you both ran it in a hugely inefficient throttle input (it generates more waste heat at lower than 100pct, the further the worse it is) and at an rpm that it couldn't effectively cool itself.

Gotta run that thing at 70pct or more. And it should be cooler.

Also when you land and stop it the core heat dumps out of it and will raise the can higher than it actually was during flight.

Expect it to be hotter than a 450 or 550. My 700's motor is pretty hot when I land too. Totally normal.
 
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Derek

Well-Known Member
Ok. That makes sense to me. I was running at 30% because that is the percentage that the Castle esc is set for in Normal mode. Stunt 1 is set for 70% and stunt 2 is 100%. I never even thought about the cuts in the can pulling "cooling" air through. I will get my packs charged up again and I'll try again...but this time I'll go to stunt 2 after leaving the ground.

After todays initial test, I am much more confident in the machine and settings.
 

pvolcko

Well-Known Member
Oh, okay. 30% throttle in the TX does not mean 30% throttle out of the ESC in that case. In the Castle ESC setup for set rpm gov mode, where you had to input your three RPM settings, there is a little info button right next to each RPM entry. Click it to see what that RPM translates into in terms of throttle amount.

My guess is you are actually fine on throttle output from the ESC. I do not believe that the heli would even hover if it were truly running that motor at 30% throttle output to the motor. :)

IF you have an optical thermometer (temperature gun) bring it with you next time and get some readings. And try a flight, even just hovering, at stunt1 or stunt2 (double check your pitch curves), just to see if it improves or worsens your heat issue.

I'm guessing everything is fine. Like I said, 600 and 700 motors get pretty hot. I can usually touch the can once or twice but not a third time without chanting some "hooosaaaah" and imagining people walking on hot coals.

Once you have a base line you can play with some of the settings in the castle ESC setup on the later tabs where it has PWM frequency, timing/advance setting, etc. Lowering timing/advance will usually result in cooler running, but also a loss of some power (probably will not be noticable if you're hovering and sport flying so give it a try). PWM frequency usually doesn't affect motor temp, but it can affect ESC temp. Lower PWM freq will lower ESC temp, but may have negative effects on motor behavior. As always, make one change at a time and do a test flight or two to see if the changes help or hurt. And save backups of your settings so you can revert back easily if you don't like a change you made.
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
The lower head speed will be working the motor harder, and because you are just hovering, the airflow over the motors is almost none existent.
My Scorpion motor in the Goblin is too hot to hold a finger on after a flight.
 

Graham Lawrie

Well-Known Member
I mentioned the slow speed in this earlier Derek:) If the motor runs slow it will not cool properly:) +1 on Paul:) +1 on Lee Scorpion motors do run hot. I was shocked how hot the first time I felt one :)
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
Thanks guys! I think I do remember Graham telling me about this, once before. Like I said, I just didn't even think about it. Too many things going through my head, lol. I am editing the video of my 500 flight right now, then I'll get that to Youtube. Then, I'll get the 600 video done up.
 

murankar

Staff member
My Scorpion was running around 130°F while hovering at 70% throttle. I used my multimeter with temp probe to get a reading. My setup was 13° pitch with 70/20 dr and expo. My blades were the rails 326mm. I also had the canopy on with an ambient temp of about 75°F.

Once i get things fixed i will be testing 10° pitch with the Gaui 325mm blades and new gyro. So will see how this translate to heat in the motor.

Sent from my LG-E980 using Forum Runner
 

danhampson

Member
the 730mx and talon 90 in my 550 come down and there just warm to touch. im running a governed HS of 2400 which is around the 90% throttle mark.

I do know that scorpion motors do run alot hotter, the 880kv scorpion in my protos was hot to touch after 1 flight

i think if you up your HS your motor and esc will come down cooler.
 

murankar

Staff member
Scorpion motors convert more electricity to usable power. Now when this happens you have heat as a by product. According to Georges this is normal. So to sum this up, Scorpion motors do run hotter than most motors.

Sent from my LG-E980 using Forum Runner
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
I have the stock Align 510kv motor in my 600. I'm going to take it out again today for some hovering. I had my timer, yesterday, set for two minutes and I'll do the same today. Just trying to get familiar with it.
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
Went flying again today with the 600 and other models, of course. You guys were definitely right about the "motor heat" issue. I listened to your advice about the head speed. I got the 600 all powered up, took it to the center-ish of the field and lifted off in Normal Mode. It's very gentle and deliberate. Awesome! I got about 6 feet in the air and went to Stunt 1. It's a very smooth transition between flight modes. I like that! I simply hovered around again...nothing special. Getting comfortable again with the sheer size of this thing. I started flipping the rudder from right to left. It holds very solid. Getting comfortable. I start bouncing it...pitch pumps, a bit. The tail pushes around as I pitch up. Ok...land it and make a gain adjustment. Take off in Normal Mode...6 feet off the ground, back to Stunt 1 and start playing around some more. It's an awesome machine.

I did notice that in a stationary hover, the helicopter wants to bank to the right a bit. I saw something in the Ikon programming where I can go and make some adjustments there. No worries!

So...I've said this before but I want you all to know that I appreciate the continued support and suggestions. It's definitely because of RCH that I am the flyer that I am. Thank you!!!
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
I had the 600 out again today. Awesome fun! It's such a solid machine...no doubt!!! I'm still making adjustments to the Pitch Precomp in the Ikon software but I'm still just testing it and working to get it dialed in. Hopefully I can do that. I love the blade noise that comes from this thing...even with just a slight punch on the sticks, I get the blade noise. Very cool!!!

Anyway....I'm loving this machine and I'm getting more comfortable and confident. Mostly getting comfortable with the size of the helicopter and getting confident in myself that I can fly it.
 

Derek

Well-Known Member
So, I've been doing some hovering, slow circuits, and mild pitch pumps with my 600. This thing is just awesome! However, I'm trying to work out an issue with the tail. In a hover and the slow circuits, the tail holds very well. When I hover and then give hard positive collective, the tail wants to kick around a bit.

We've spoke about this topic before but I have another question. In my DX8, my Gyro is set for:

Normal Mode: 65.5 (this gets me 45% on the Ikon software)
Stunt 1: 61.0
Stunt 2: 40.0 (although I haven't flown in Stunt 2 yet.)

So, to help get the tail solid on hard collective climb outs, should i raise the gyro gains or add more to the Pitch Precomp? I did add 10% to the Pitch Precomp but stopped there because i had to pack up and head back home.
 
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