Quad Want to build (or buy) a FPV Quadracopter

GregC

Member
Hello my friends,
Tony suggested posting here, so here goes.
Well, I have purchased my DX7s w/3 receivers for $299. Going to pick it up tomorrow, and possibly a 130x if it is in stock. Thanks to everyone for helping me to make a decision.

Now to the point. I got on the the FPV thread which was a big mistake! Used to fly ultralight but quit because my wife saw it as a death machine. So you know how that ended.
Makes a nice lawn ornament!

I have read most all the threads in the FPV section before I posted this to glean others questions before threading away.

I am setting my goals on a FPV Quad for the future. I have wife's blessing, so man is happy. (I just don't know exactly how much this will cost me later when she sees shiny stuff)

I have been looking at some QAV500 videos and it looks like a very stable high end unit. The frame kit is pretty reasonable, but it's the other stuff that is scarry $$$. I figure that by the time ur done, you could be digging into $1000 minimally.

I know that u probably have to or would want to buy all the parts, drive system, video rx's, tx's, batt's, motors, and then you have to put it all together. Are there step by step manuals? Soldering and mechanical skills is not a problem.

I thought that this package for goggles looked pretty good, but still need to research. Fat Shark PredatorV2 RTF FPV Headset System w/Camera and 5.8G TX

I have been to ReadyMade Rc which will without a doubt have the video equip. You just have to pay for it. :) And boy, the platform really has to be stable, quite unlike flying a heli. One visual disorientation and you are in the dirt!

In the end, I want to be able to fly FPV just like the guys in Spain. Out to maybe a mile or less eventually. Put some night light LED's on to scare the shavings out of the neighbors kids (with permission). I love it! My neighbors never know what will come out of my airspace next. I want clear crisp video feed, just like theirs, and to be able to record it, and display a live feed to my friends on the flight line. (I know that HD video has to be recorded onboard, I'm sure 720 will be fine for now) Also, I will probably want the visual telemetry in the flight goggles. It's just plain Kool, but I am also it is helpful if on a fixed wing. The "Peguin" is amazing! And reasonably priced too. Although I'm thinking Quad first. I mentioned on my other thread that there is no one in our flying club with heli's but me. And I won't be impressing anyone with anything cool for quite some time! So point me, steer me, poke me, in the right direction please. I hope that this will be an interesting thread. Thanks in advance for your wise guru advice. Grasshopper listen now.

Soooo, I'm hooked and ready to go! I probably won't like the price, but I won't have to buy it all at once. So have at me. My brain is almost scrambled from research, but I only know enough to be dangerous.
 

breeze400

Spagetti Pilot
You should look into building a h quad for your first go at it. It's very cheap to build and flys just has good has anything out there. Then after you get your hands wet so to speek, get a qav500 for your good set up. Anyway that what I suggest!
 

Tasajara

Active Member
I have built a few quads for myself and others.... and as breeze said a H quad is a good one to start with... I have a BlueSkyRC.com xRotor IFrame Quad (H-Quad).
Very well made kit and it want break the bank to start out on $39.95. I have a build thread <<HERE>>
It is cheap to repair if you break a boom, $1.49 at Lowes. The frames are real tuff, I have had many oops and the frame always makes it.
I have some of the suppo motors he sales, they are a good middle of the road motor. The 1200kv I use a 8x4.5 prop and on the 1100kv motors I use a 9x5.
The best control board I have found for the money is the Flip MWC Flight Controller 1.5 I started a thread on it <<HERE>> As far as esc's there are all types, but if you want some that are programmed/ flashed for multirotors RCTimer.com has some Flashed with Rapid ESC firmware by Simonk, you can find them <<HERE>> I bought 8 the last time I ordered, and they have been working great. They have a nice smooth throttle response. Plus they will make the motors run quieter, no pop,click or high pitch Freq. wine. One other thing , I got 1 whole min longer on my flight time when I used the Flashed ESC over stock ones.

So that all being said:::

xRotor IFrame $39.95
4- Suppo motors $62-$66
4- SimonK Multicopter ESC 20A $44
Flip MWC Flight Controller $25
Set of 4 props $7 but always buy extra :)

So for less that $200 you could have a nice quad flying...
There are always a few extra things you would need so
make it $250 or so if you build it yourself.

If you have any questions let me know I will try to help you answer them.

As far as FPV gear I buy all my items from Ready Made RC The Online store is run by someone who flys FPV, and if you ever have a problem he will take care of it.
When I spend that kind of money on Video equip. I like to buy local. But If buying other than local, I would buy name brand stuff.

This is my Diversity FPV Ground Station
07 -  long range.JPG


Also the good clean video you see posted on YouTube is not always what the person flying is seeing on the video from an FPV system
Most of the time it is recored from a GoPro direct to an SD card. And a separate camera is used
like <<THIS>> and this <<CASE>> Then the signal is sent to the video TX and then sent from the Video RX to your viewing source. The GoPro has a live feed that can also be sent to the Video TX.
Don't get me wrong, you can get a good clean video, just it want be as clear as the recorded one.
I use 1.3GHz it will fly behind trees and objects pretty good. And if you use 2.4GHz radio the 2 Freq. you can use are 900MHz & 5.8GHz .
900MHz works very well along with 5.8GHz. Just 5.8GHZ want go behind trees and objects as well, you may have slight signal loss.

My xRotor IFrame flys great... here is one of my videos I did in Nov with it..

07 -  long range.JPG
 
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Lee

Well-Known Member
Hi Greg,
Its a real mine field out there, trying to find what good and whats not. I went through that process, just like you are doing. Spent months researching till my brain fried.
There are many many ways to go here. All have there pros and cons. I will try to sort them out for you.

Here are some suggestions as a first DIY Quad.
I have built an H quad with very cheap components.
Pros: Cheap to build and repair. Easier to orientate over a classic X quad, more space to place your equipment (FPV)
Cons: Fragile, the arms break off the frame very easily.

Classic quad. With aluminium arms Quad copter build
Same components as H Quad
Pros: Very strong arms, more manuoverable.
Cons: Orientation, Space for Electronics.

First off the shelf Quad.
RCTimer have some great frames at a cheap price.http://www.rctimer.com/index.php?gOo=goods_details.dwt&goodsid=787&productname=
If you want a ready to fly out of the box, and local. These guys are one of the best quads
Craig already mentioned Bluesky RC xRotor IFrame Quad (H-Quad) [IFRAMEQUAD] - $39.99 : BlueSkyRC.com, RC Things that Fly


For cheap electronics.
Again RCtimer have just about everything you need. Motors/ESCs
More locally Suppo Brushless Motors | Luke's RC Planes
Control boards:
There are many to choose from.
I have used the KK V2 LCD board on my H quad. Hobbyking KK2.0 Multi-rotor LCD Flight Control Board
I would highly recommend this one. It has an LCD screen to program everything. Very straight forward to set up. No need for a PC link, which is fantastic. When you are setting up your quad for the first time, who wants to have to keep plugging in the board every 5 mins to change a setting, then fly then change. Real pain in the butt. With this, you fly, land, press a couple of buttons, take off again. Simple.

For FPV
Your choice is a good one.
Flying FPV is actually very easy if you are good at Computer games. There is no orientation to worry about, like with normal flying. Forward, back left and right are always the same.

These are just a few things to consider. There are many other option, good and bad. Just choose some thing, post it up here, and one of us will tell you if its a good choice or not.
Best of luck.
 
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Tony

Staff member
See Greg, I told you that you would get some good information here. One of these days I will take their advice and build one of these.
 

GregC

Member
Thanks guys! I really appreciate your detail. I am going to put together a shopping list and get started with more detailed research. Thanks for taking the time to key this info. I will post my intentions in a bit and get your input. Right now i am fighting with my DX7s. the manual is really not intended for newbies. The system setup will not let me input my heli. Got my name in and that is it. Gave me a migrane so i set it aside and went to fly my chinese junker. I will get on utube and get some understandable instructions tomorrow.
 

Tony

Staff member
Just post your question in the Spektrum section and we will walk you through it step by step. Never be afraid to ask question on here bro. We are here to help.

Can't wait to see your ideas on your first quad.
 

GregC

Member
Ok guys, here is somewhat of a plan for my first FPV Quad. I have taken your advice and looked at the suggestions and compiled a list. Please offer advice on what will be best for me to start with, and bear in mind that I do not want to build a piece of junk that just kinda gets me there. I like quality, but I also like reasonable prices, and I fully understand that sometimes those two concepts don't always meet at a comfortable satisfaction point.

Xrotor Iframe Quad $39.99
http://blueskyrc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=13&products_id=59

Motors
The Suppo A2212-11 - 1200kv Outrunner Motor $16.50 x 4 = $66.00
http://blueskyrc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=38

ESC
RCTimer SK ESC 20A Brushless Motor Speed Controller $10.99 x 4 = $43.96

Flight Controller Options
#1 Flip MWC Flight Controller 1.5 $18.00 + pins http://witespyquad.gostorego.com/flip-mwc-flight-controller.html

#2 Hobbyking KK2.0 Multi-rotor LCD Flight Control Board $29.99
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...2_0_Multi_rotor_LCD_Flight_Control_Board.html

#3 MWC Blank Board - Bob's Super Simple Shield Wii (should prob stay away from this because I have no idea what to do with it)

I am wondering about servo stabilization. There is 3 and 6 servo stabilization. I really like the Hobbyking KK2 because it has an auto level function.

I have 3 Spectrum Receivers AR8000, AR611, AR400. One should work.

Blades
Black Carbon Filled 8 x 4.5 Props (Quad 4 pack) 5mm hub $8
http://blueskyrc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=6&products_id=63

Bluesky Landing skid $6.99
Http://blueskyrc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=19

Looks like around $200 will get me this far as you have suggested. Not bad for a starter.



I have to make some decisions about FPV equipment though. There is this trick below for $280, but for $200 more (that I don't have right now could get me into a much nicer setup (maybe).
ImmersionRC 5.8gHz 600mw Video Transmitter $70, Uno 5.8GHz NexWave A/V Receiver v2 $80
Attitude SD Goggles $360 with diopter adjustment. I could possible put this on my first unit at the extra expense and move the Tx later to a QAV500 and simply replace it on the first unit with a much cheaper Tx just to toy around with, because I am sure that I will likely always fly my first bird for kicks rather than zooming around in the backyard with a $2500 platform.

Fat Shark PredatorV2 RTF FPV Headset System w/Camera and 5.8G TX $280.00
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/...roduct=28342&gclid=CIy03eiAgLUCFQq0nQodrEQAog
I am concerned about the 300 to 500 meter range. Need more research. How are guys getting 1 mile range from their FPV. I am assuming that they are using the 500Mw transmitters and a whopping antanna. I have seen UHF Tx and Rx I think is supposed to be for long distance video.

Add later or to other Quad Includes GPS and Telemetry display. $249.00
APM 2.5+ Assembled (Side entry) with 915Mhz (US) Telemetry Set
Http://store.diydrones.com/APM_2_5_Not_Assembled_p/br-apmpwrkt2-telem915.htm
Recorded GPS data could help go straight to a downed aircraft fairly quickly.
Telemetry would probably be much more valid on a fixed wing, cause man those things can reach on up there.

I am hesitantly assuming that there are instructions for assembling all this stuff. My greatest fear is letting the smoke out of expensive stuff making stupid mistakes. I assemble electronic relay panels at work and do soldering, and simple PLC writing, but it seems to me that some of this stuff is quite intimidating with all the frequencies and communication devices on several levels, even though it is small in size, because there is no indication of detailed instruction for assembling attached to the products, or to attach the products together. You would think that the suppliers of these controllers would speak as to the ease of installation of their products by their available instruction, or am I really reaching here.

I think that I may need to talk to Ready Made Rc also, after hearing your comments and before placing any orders.

One thing that I would like for you guys to know is that I am very serious about this project.
I am almost asking myself if I should pop for a QAV500, and build it slowly as I have the cash, but by the time I get it built with GPS, Telemetry, GoPro, and everything else, I will have over 2K in it, so that's kind of foolish to do all that for a beginner Quad. A man can wish I suppose.
Although I am impressed with the DJI Naza M Multi-Rotor Stabilization Controller and GPS/Compass $399.00 is amazing, although I think that on screen telemetry will still require another module.

So please let me have your thoughts about my direction.

Eventually I do want to build a QAV500. My end ambition is to use it as a search and rescue platform with full telemetry and a sensative gimballed belly cam for the downlink observers. We live in a rural county, and I also know the bomb squad area commander for our 7 county region has only 4 team members on it and they have no high tech visualization toys. It might be fun to practice with them, for future use. Some day I could build a heavy lifter to pick up suspicious packages and deposit them into the bomb blast containment vessel. Ok, now I'm dreaming (a little).
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
That looks like a good first set up for the Quad. I personally prefer the Spider Quad for simplicity. Going by looks alone, as i haven't had one.
As for the FPV equipment.
I went the cheap route first. Everything worked well, but i soon changed to better equipment.
If you want a simple system that works very well This is what i have.
Dominator Goggles with internal 5.8ghz TX
ImmersionRC 600mW RX for the quad.
ImmersionRC Circular polarised antennas. These will give you better range and the casing protects these delicate antennas.

This set up has no external cables to get in the way, which i love. Just pop the goggles on and fly.
 

Tasajara

Active Member
Looks like a good list.... Greg.. Just wanted to let you know that the Flip MWC also has auto level.
The IFrame is a great pick, It has lots of room for all your equipment, FPV ,Camera ect.
And the best thing is, there want be any props in the picture when flying FPV.
The props you picked are stiffer than the basic GemFan props. But when ever you an even smoother
flight I suggest getting a set of Graupners 8x5 e props, this sight is a good place to buy props.
That is after you get the hang of it, they are not cheap. ;)
They will pull a little less amps, but you get longer flight times. They will have just a little less punch that the slow fly
type props.

here is a pic of my IFrame...
02- XrotorIFrame green cam.JPG

02- XrotorIFrame green cam.JPG
 

GregC

Member
Hi Tasajara, What about instructions for assembling all the stuff correctly? I have absolutely no one to help me but you guys. Our local RC club consists of fixed wing LOS flyers only. When you say quadracopter to them or FPV, they go what? It's really frustrating. I can't even call any of them about my heli trouble.
I recently got onto www.readytoflyquads.com. Their large package RTF FPV units are about the same price if you built it yourself. It may not be a QAV500, but awful close. (not ready to spend that kind of money yet though). What camera and Goggles do you use on your IFrame above?
 

GregC

Member
Thanks for the input Tas, Was the "might be a ufo" shot with your IFrame setup? What about the instructions for setting up and connecting all the boards and receivers with the proper cables and connections and so forth. Do instructions come with the boards and other electronics. There is no indication that they do. Also what FPV setup do you use. Is it the same as Lee's or different.
I also recently looked at www.readytoflyquads.com and their largest Quad similar to the QAV500 is FPV RTF with bells and whistles for around $2k which is what all the parts cost including video for the QAV500.
(can't spend that kind of $$ yet, but just sayin.)

- - - Updated - - -

Sorry for the repeat, didn't realize that post had moved to 2nd page.
 

breeze400

Spagetti Pilot
Generally you have to download the manuels for the boards. If you look at HK's sight for the KK board, the manuel download is on the same page has the board. towards the bottem. the other boards your looking for just do a search for the manuel. It will come up somewhere.
 

Tasajara

Active Member
Nice Video.... I would have crashed into the beach chairs.. I need a lot more practice to do that kind of flying... Guess I am a better builder than flyer right now..

This is one Video I like ...pretty cool...he has great control...
Hexacopter in Cameroon
 
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GregC

Member
Equally amazing, if not better! I am beginning to get to the point of putting my cards on the table and building a QAV500. They are evidently the bomb, and pretty much as good as it gets from the looking that I have done (although you have to choose good equipment for the platform). I have some equipment that I need to sell that will give me the cash to begin a build and pay as I go, if I choose to go that route. I used to fly an ultralight and this FPV video will get me back that feeling times 10 with the flight capabilities. I just know that you can get absorbed into the FPV experience (without risking your toush!) Wife likes that part! My wife and I are developing an animal therapy center for abused, foster, and handicapped children in our area, and Man! this medium may bring new experiences to some handicapped children. Just thinking out loud.
 

Lee

Well-Known Member
Justin (Juz) is one of the top guys for Multirotor FPV, not just his flying skill but his video editing as well. There is a new QAV in the works. Slightly smaller called the QAV400 :D
 

Tasajara

Active Member
That will be cool... Lee.... may have to get one... like I need another quad.... :p

Oh yeah.... the QAV is nice.. I have one of those myself. I have enough parts to get it flying, but I was buying some higher end equipment to finish the build.

so far this is what I have:
QAV500 FPV Quadcopter Frame v1.2
Tiger Motor MT-4006-13 740kv
TEAM BLACKSHEEP CORE
Team BlackSheep RF Tin Shield for CORE
DX201 DPS camera
HobbyKing 30A BlueSeries
I flashed them with Wii ESC firmware, and removed the 3 BEMF capacitors that do filtering because the filtering is done in the Wii code.
I used these items to do my Flashing....
Atmel Atmega Socket Firmware Flashing Tool
USBasp AVR Programming Device for ATMEL proccessors
as far as props go, it is between the XOAR PJN 10x6 Matched Pair or the Graupner E-Prop 10x5 I do think I am leaning toward the Xoar props.
My RX will be: EZUHF 8 Channel Lite Receiver
Video: 1.3GHz 300mW Transmitter
Rib Bones Landing Gear
Not decided on my Main Control Board yet...

The only items I have not got yet are the props , EzUHF RX and main control board, So once I get all my items I will get started on my build. :highly_amused:
 
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