General At a complete loss

T

treff

Active Member
Well guys I am at a complete loss. I still have very bad vibration in the helicopter. So far I have changed.
!. Complete head.
2. Complete tail.
3. Complete drive gear.
4. New blades.
I don't think there is any thing left.
Just installed new head and run up without the blades on vibration very bad. I can actually see two tails because the vibration is so bad. I can not do a video yet because awaiting new one to arrive.
So question is where to go next? I am thinking of the bin or as they say in the USA, the garbage.
 
Slobberdog

Slobberdog

Well-Known Member
are you using the shaft you had in there or the new one, the cheaper heads have been known to come with bent shafts often,
 
T

treff

Active Member
I am using the shaft that came with the head. I have some Align ones so I will change. Getting close to sticking this in the bin now but thanks for the suggestion Slobberdog. Could it be the bearings or the bearing blocks. That's the only thing I have not changed? Oh well back to the work bench. Cheers
 
Slobberdog

Slobberdog

Well-Known Member
Treff lots of complaints about main shafts coming bent even in new packets of shafts, thats bad, and as Sam says warped gears can cause vibration, that is what Graham found on the 450 i sold him.
 
T

treff

Active Member
Thanks guys. I have changed the main shaft and gear drive for Align parts and still the vibration is there. I think it is time to put this one aside. I have run out of ideas and patients. It's time to move on and at least get some flying in. Thanks again. Cheers
 
Lee

Lee

Well-Known Member
Treff, I spent 5 months searching for a vibe in my 450. I changed every part on it that i thought would cause the vibration, even the motor. In the end it was the simplest thing, the boom. I changed it for another one and the vibes disappeared. The first was carbon and the second was the stock aluminium.
Its got to be one of the moving parts.
Strip the heli down to the last moving part, which would be the motor. Then add each moving part back until you find the vibes.
1) Spin the motor up, feel for vibes. If you feel any, you can balance the motor by wrapping a small zip tie around the motor and turn it 1/4 turn every test, until you find the position with the least vibes.
2) Add the main gears and shaft. Check for wobbles in the gears. If you see any, you can try to bend it slightly to reduce the wobble, or in my case, i adjusted the tightness of the screws holding the main gear to the one way bearing case to straighten it, sort of like adjusting the spokes on a wheel.Put your finger nail against the top of the main shaft to feel for movement.
3) Add the tail drive front gear. They can have bent shafts too.
4) Add the head components.
5) Add the tail boom, case and tail shaft.
6) add the tail hub and grips.
7) finally add the blades.
Hopefully at one of these steps, the vibes will become apparent.
Good luck mate :)
 
T

treff

Active Member
Thanks for the info Lee. A biggish job but will give it a go. I definitely need another heli. One to fly, one to build. Just when I was getting to grips with the flying part. LOL. Thanks also to Slobberdog and breeze400. The hunt for the vibes is on.
 
T

treff

Active Member
Well guys I think I have found the problem or at least part of the problem. I did as Lee suggested took bits off and run the heli up to see what happens. I got to the paddles on the fly bar. Took them off. Run it up, smooth, not dead smooth but certainly flyable. So I would never have guessed. Unfortunately I do not have anything to weight them with but I can change them for different ones. Thanks again.
 
Slobberdog

Slobberdog

Well-Known Member
Maybe they were not completely parallel to each other or they were not quite the same distance from the flybar cage,
 
T

treff

Active Member
Hi Slobberdog. Well the paddles were as straight as I could get them. I have now fitted a new set and the difference is quite remarkable. The helicopter is strangely docile, infact you could almost put the tx on the floor and the helicopter just sits there in the hover. Still got vibration in the tail but no where near as bad. Onward with the next build. Cheers
 
Westy

Westy

LEGEND
Hi There Treff.

If you have not weighed them .... then I am guessing you did not weigh any of your other blades (Main and Tail)

In that Case .... I am guessing here too .... but you possibly have not don the most important part.

Weighed the main blades ... tail blades ..... and done the CG and Balancing of them.?

Have you done the TRACKING??

These are Very ... very ...very important steps. If overlooked ... you will be chasing your tail (Excuse the pun) to solve your issue

IMPORTANT: Have you spun the heli up with no blades at all on it .... if the Vibe has gone ..... you have either a balancing problem or a CG ... or both.

Also screw the 2 main blades together .... (not too tight ... ) and look between the blades... if you have a gap between the surfaces ... then your brass insets are not inserted into the blades (done at manufacture) perpendicular to the blade surface .... and that will most certainly be the vibe issue.
 
T

treff

Active Member
Hi Westy thanks for the great info. I have not weighted any blades to be honest. I haven't the scales for something this small. I do track the blades, that's no problem, only weighting things. I will have to make this my next purchase. Okay on the looking at the main blades. That's a great tip. Thanks. My next build, if I ever finish this one is another 450. I have enough parts now LOL and just means putting it together. I need to helicopters, on flyer, on repairer LOL and I will look for something better when my flying improves. Thanks again all for the info and tips.
 
Westy

Westy

LEGEND
no PRobs .....

Something like this will do you well in your hobby room .... only $7.79 USD

0.01g x 300g Mini Digital Pocket Scale Jewelry Diamond LCD Weight Balance Black - BuyinCoins.com

031020.jpg
 
Lee

Lee

Well-Known Member
Get a set of carbon ones. Nice and light. Also check as Kev said, if the fly bar is the same distance on both sides and the paddles are perfectly parallel. Glad you at least found the issue.
 
Tony

Tony

Staff member
What you are experiencing here is the good ole catch 22 that china likes to put out. On one hand, it's cheap to get into a ccpm heli. On the other hand, you are going to be working on it more than you are flying. As a LOT of us have stated before, you get what you pay for. Go out and get you a good align super combo, put this heli on a shelf, or better yet, the trash can, and forget all about it. The align bird will work without vibration and you will start learning how to fly, and not just work on them.
 
Slobberdog

Slobberdog

Well-Known Member
Hey Treff more words of wisdom from Tony there, I bought cheap and it bit me in the behind, (be it Graham has it flying now) but I found you replace something and then something else will need doing or replacing,

I bought the Align 450 Pro DFC cos I was ticked off and fed up with chasing my tail, I have put about a dozen batteries through the heli now and its not missed a beat, it was a pleasure to build and the quality is amazing.

Total night and day bettween Align and China...................
 
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