450 spektrum AR7200BX / DX9 setup question...
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Slobberdog
Well-Known Member
You want blue for 1520 and blue flash for 333hz
See table direct off beastx website
-= BEASTX - BE ABSOLUTE STABLE =-
See table direct off beastx website
-= BEASTX - BE ABSOLUTE STABLE =-
so even though the frequency for the servo is 330, i still choose 333?
and i couldnt find that tabel on the beastx website... i tired a few links to it, but they were all dead.
Slobberdog
Well-Known Member
Yeah 333hz is close enough,
And if you go on beastx website under support then servoliste
And if you go on beastx website under support then servoliste
Nade
Member
I’m hoping I’m in the right place. I have the AR7200BX mounted on an Align 600L dominator. I am in the process of programming the 7200 and have reached the menu “N”. While I was using Tony’s video on it’s set up to make sure I understood it properly it is my understanding that with the elevator or rear servo in the upper position, rotating the bird on it’s shaft the position of the servo should remain the same. If it does not then the opposite setting needs to be applied. In my case using the other setting there is no change in how the swash reacts. As a pivot the helicopter on it’s shaft by the time I have reached 180° turn the servo has gone down rather than remained up. It does not change, but does the same thing on either setting. I’m looking for any insight or solution to this issue because it seems it should be just the opposite on one of the settings than what it’s doing.
Tony
Staff member
It's not the servo that you are watching in that menu, it's the swash. When you go into that menu, your swash will tilt in a direction, and as you turn the helicopter, the swash should stay tilted in that direction no matter where the helicopter is. So if you are looking at the swash in front of you with the nose of the helicopter facing you and the swash tilts towards you, if you turn the helicopter 180 where the nose is now facing away from you, the swash should still be tilted towards you, not towards the nose. In other words, while spinning the helicopter, it should appear as if the swash is not moving. Hope that makes sense.
Nade
Member
Hi Tony! Thanks for your reply! Yeah, I wrestled with this for some time. The wording in the manual isn’t clear to me. But I understand now. The wording seemed to be saying if in my case when I entered the N menu the swash would lift up at the elevator servo, or at the rear. That’s where the swash would be pointing up. As I spun the heli on the shaft, I thought what they were saying is the swash would remain up at the rear. But what I understand happens now, and the diagram in the manual shows, is with the swash pointing up at the rear, as I turn the heli to the right the swash will raise up on the right side of the heli. Turn it more to the right and the swash rises up at its front. The gist being that if when entering the N memo the swash moves up pointing east, as you rotate the bird the high point of the swash will always be up at its east position.
Now you mentioned in your video that you thought it was the coolest menu in the entire set up. I understand it has to do with performing a pirouette but I’m not sure what it refers to. I’m assuming it has to do with maintaining its level position during the pirouette. What is it about this setting adjustment that you feel that way about it?
Thanks much for you time Tony! Very much appreciated!
Now you mentioned in your video that you thought it was the coolest menu in the entire set up. I understand it has to do with performing a pirouette but I’m not sure what it refers to. I’m assuming it has to do with maintaining its level position during the pirouette. What is it about this setting adjustment that you feel that way about it?
Thanks much for you time Tony! Very much appreciated!
Smoggie
Well-Known Member
Yep, when setting 'piro compensation' the swash should act like a compass in that that when you turn the heli the swash always leans toward the same compass heading.
On most modern FBL you dont have to do this step as it's looked after automatically by inputting the mounting orientation of the FBL unit, which is a much easier way to do it IMHO.
On most modern FBL you dont have to do this step as it's looked after automatically by inputting the mounting orientation of the FBL unit, which is a much easier way to do it IMHO.
Nade
Member
Thanks smoggie! I’m setting this 7200 up on my 770 which went down last fall. I hadn’t done anything with it except put it back in its storage bag since it went down. I decided to piece it out what was still usable and sell it and not bother rebuilding it but since I had the storage bag and wishing there was a flight worthy bird in it I decided to look for a used shell. Within a matter of 24 hours I came across one that had virtually everything I needed in the bird, including the servos landing gear, boom. I didn’t need the ESC or the motor because those are still good.
I wasn’t going to use the receiver I had in it because I found apparently it was a receiver issue that caused it to go down. I had the spirit pro in it along with one other bird. I have that Align 600L dominator I believe I told you about sometime ago and twice after flying it, it sat for a month or two then going to fly it again it was no longer bound to the radio. Then since the 770 went down using the same receiver I found it acted the same way as the receiver did in the 600. Too long to get into the details here but I am convinced that the reason the 770 went down was because it lost radio contact. The only difference between the 770 and the 600 was the 600 was on the ground when it happened, twice, where the 770 was in the air when it happened. I can go more into detail if there’s interest and explain how I came up with this but for the time being, thanks for your comment, much appreciated!
I wasn’t going to use the receiver I had in it because I found apparently it was a receiver issue that caused it to go down. I had the spirit pro in it along with one other bird. I have that Align 600L dominator I believe I told you about sometime ago and twice after flying it, it sat for a month or two then going to fly it again it was no longer bound to the radio. Then since the 770 went down using the same receiver I found it acted the same way as the receiver did in the 600. Too long to get into the details here but I am convinced that the reason the 770 went down was because it lost radio contact. The only difference between the 770 and the 600 was the 600 was on the ground when it happened, twice, where the 770 was in the air when it happened. I can go more into detail if there’s interest and explain how I came up with this but for the time being, thanks for your comment, much appreciated!
Smoggie
Well-Known Member
I hope you have much better luck with the new 770. Did you sell the Spirit pro?.. I'm just wondering why you didn't use the Spirit Pro but with a new receiver? With the latest Spirit firmware you can use up to three receivers (two satellites and one Spektrum spm4649t diversity antenna serial receiver). This gives triple receiver redundancy and up to 6 antenna diversity. This is about the most reliable and bullet proof system you could imagine, you could have two receivers fail and still keep flying! It also has the advantage of built in telemetry from the SPM4649t and integration with your transmitter so you can do the full FBL setup and tuning from the Tx.
I'm using this setup myself and it's faultless.
I'm using this setup myself and it's faultless.
Nade
Member
Oh I did use the spirit pro in the 770. That’s what was in it when it went down. When I finally took the 770 back out of its storage bag I decided to do a little test to confirm my suspicions. I simply took it and connected the primary battery to the receiver and servos after turning on the TX. I found out the receiver was no longer bound to the TX.
This was the same issue I had with the Align 600L dominator. I had a spirit pro in that as well and as I mentioned earlier after flying it two separate individual times and letting it sit for a month or so I went to fly it again and it was no longer bound to the radio. That happened twice while it was hanging on the wall. The only difference with the 600 was that it was on the ground. I connected the primary battery to the receiver and servos in preparation for flight. That’s when I found that the 600 was no longer bound to the TX. After the 600 initialized the very first thing that happened was the aileron servo went down to its bottom of travel.
That behavior occurred both times after connecting the primary pack. When the 770 went down, despite tempting to maintain control it rolled to the left and went down. I suspect that the aileron servo acted the exact same way as it did on the 600 once the connection to the TX was lost. It simply rolled down to the bottom of its travel which caused the 770 to roll to the left and the rest is history and the rest is history .
So yes, I did sell them just this week on eBay. I had three spirit pros, two that I bought and one that came with a scale heli I bought used from a friend. An A-109 with a 500 glass align clone it that was in the middle of being built. That Spirit pro hadn’t been used yet but was connected to the bird but since I’d have the problems with the 7 70 and 600 dominator I simply could not trust that receiver anymore and decided to sell them. I had three of them that I sold this past week.
When I first bought the goblin 630 and 770 I put the spectrum AR7200BX in them. Never had any issues with those so I decided to go back to them. I do like the fact that you don’t have to plug the receiver into a computer to program. It it’s a much easier set up.
This was the same issue I had with the Align 600L dominator. I had a spirit pro in that as well and as I mentioned earlier after flying it two separate individual times and letting it sit for a month or so I went to fly it again and it was no longer bound to the radio. That happened twice while it was hanging on the wall. The only difference with the 600 was that it was on the ground. I connected the primary battery to the receiver and servos in preparation for flight. That’s when I found that the 600 was no longer bound to the TX. After the 600 initialized the very first thing that happened was the aileron servo went down to its bottom of travel.
That behavior occurred both times after connecting the primary pack. When the 770 went down, despite tempting to maintain control it rolled to the left and went down. I suspect that the aileron servo acted the exact same way as it did on the 600 once the connection to the TX was lost. It simply rolled down to the bottom of its travel which caused the 770 to roll to the left and the rest is history and the rest is history .
So yes, I did sell them just this week on eBay. I had three spirit pros, two that I bought and one that came with a scale heli I bought used from a friend. An A-109 with a 500 glass align clone it that was in the middle of being built. That Spirit pro hadn’t been used yet but was connected to the bird but since I’d have the problems with the 7 70 and 600 dominator I simply could not trust that receiver anymore and decided to sell them. I had three of them that I sold this past week.
When I first bought the goblin 630 and 770 I put the spectrum AR7200BX in them. Never had any issues with those so I decided to go back to them. I do like the fact that you don’t have to plug the receiver into a computer to program. It it’s a much easier set up.
Smoggie
Well-Known Member
The Spirit Pro isn't a receiver, it's a flybarless controller. It has no receiver functionality whatsoever. It has to be connected to a seperate receiver (either a satellite type or standard type).
It's not the Spirit Pro that binds to the Tx, it's the receiver(s) that bind. The problem of losing bind can only be due to a problem with the receiver or the transmitter, it could not possibly be due to the Spirit Pro because the spirit pro is not a receiver and was never bound in the first place.
If you were losing bind with a range of different receivers than the only 'single point of failure' would appear to be the transmitter. My advice would be to send the Tx in for a checkup/service. It's a shame that you got rid of the Spirits bacause they are a far better FBL controller than the AR7200.. Not that there is anything really wrong with the AR7200 but the Spirit is a lot more advanced and has rescue functionality that the AR7200 lacks.
It's not the Spirit Pro that binds to the Tx, it's the receiver(s) that bind. The problem of losing bind can only be due to a problem with the receiver or the transmitter, it could not possibly be due to the Spirit Pro because the spirit pro is not a receiver and was never bound in the first place.
If you were losing bind with a range of different receivers than the only 'single point of failure' would appear to be the transmitter. My advice would be to send the Tx in for a checkup/service. It's a shame that you got rid of the Spirits bacause they are a far better FBL controller than the AR7200.. Not that there is anything really wrong with the AR7200 but the Spirit is a lot more advanced and has rescue functionality that the AR7200 lacks.
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Nade
Member
Yes, I am aware that the spirit isn’t actually a “receiver”. I just have a habit of typing it in as an RX instead of an fbl. However, the manual does state it can be used as a stand alone tail gyro, a term I’ve heard the Spektrum AR7200 referred to as. The manual also shows the wiring for a stand alone application. This is the set up I used on my Trex 600L Dominator. The only addition to the Spirit was two Spektrum 9645 satellites. It flew beautifully with that setup. The setup on my 770 was the spirit coupled with a Spektrum AR7700 and a Spektrum 9645 satellite connected to the 7700.
The issue that occurred on both birds had the same characteristics. During the 770 fight the aileron servo simply moved down causing the 770 to roll left which is what brought it down. On the 600L as soon as the spirit finished its initialization sequence after connecting the primary battery the aileron servo moved down, stayed there and there was no response to any TX commands, not until I bound it again to the TX. Testing the remains of the 770 after the crash there was no response to any TX commands, again, not until the system was rebound to the TX.
I’ve had the DX9 TX for some time now. I have just over 20 birds with most of them bound to the DX9 and have not had one issue with any of the other birds bound to it. I cannot point my finger at the TX when the spirit is the only unit that I’ve ever had anything like this happen, whether it was coupled with a remote RX or without. In any event it’s all water over the damn. I’ve concentrated on utilizing the RX units I originally had in both my Goblins which is the AR7200. Those have been a flawless operating system for me.
The original idea of getting into these fbls bailout feature just hasn’t panned out because of their complexity in setting them up. With the 7200 there’s no need to connect the unit to a computer. Just follow the manual and it flys nice. It just doesn’t have any bailout.
The issue that occurred on both birds had the same characteristics. During the 770 fight the aileron servo simply moved down causing the 770 to roll left which is what brought it down. On the 600L as soon as the spirit finished its initialization sequence after connecting the primary battery the aileron servo moved down, stayed there and there was no response to any TX commands, not until I bound it again to the TX. Testing the remains of the 770 after the crash there was no response to any TX commands, again, not until the system was rebound to the TX.
I’ve had the DX9 TX for some time now. I have just over 20 birds with most of them bound to the DX9 and have not had one issue with any of the other birds bound to it. I cannot point my finger at the TX when the spirit is the only unit that I’ve ever had anything like this happen, whether it was coupled with a remote RX or without. In any event it’s all water over the damn. I’ve concentrated on utilizing the RX units I originally had in both my Goblins which is the AR7200. Those have been a flawless operating system for me.
The original idea of getting into these fbls bailout feature just hasn’t panned out because of their complexity in setting them up. With the 7200 there’s no need to connect the unit to a computer. Just follow the manual and it flys nice. It just doesn’t have any bailout.
Smoggie
Well-Known Member
Fair enough. Al I know for 100% certain is the two Spirit's I've got have been absolutely bullet proof, never a glitch and I've been running one of them since the Spirit pro was first released, the other is on the heli that I fly most often of any of my fleet. The rescue function works great to, setup is not hard once you get to understand how it works. Funny thing is I find the blinky LED light and wiggly Tx stick programming method infuriating and non-intuitive. Programming by PC, smart phone (or through your Tx programming menu) like the Spirit offers i find much easier.. Each to their own i guess.
BTW.. On the 600L if one servo failed energise on power up and just moved down under the weight of the rotor, that is not so uncommon. It's caused by the servo failing to initialise which is in turn caused by the BEC not 'ramping up' it's output voltage quickly enough. I've had the same thing several times on my own Trex 600 (which has a vbar). The Castle BEC pro is known to cause this with some servos. The solution is simply to power cycle the heli (no need to re-bind).
This issue (if that's what it was) cant occur in flight because once the servo is initialised then it's good, it's only that first initialisation that can sometimes fail. This failure generally happens on the first flight of the day or after the heli has been idle for a while. On my Trex 600 is happens on something like 1 in 10 first flights.
If you have experienced this then it's really important to do a pre flight check before every flight to make sure all servos are working. If it was this initialisation issue then it's nothing to do with the FBL, its entirely a BEC and servo compatibility thing. It could not explain the Goblin crash.
BTW.. On the 600L if one servo failed energise on power up and just moved down under the weight of the rotor, that is not so uncommon. It's caused by the servo failing to initialise which is in turn caused by the BEC not 'ramping up' it's output voltage quickly enough. I've had the same thing several times on my own Trex 600 (which has a vbar). The Castle BEC pro is known to cause this with some servos. The solution is simply to power cycle the heli (no need to re-bind).
This issue (if that's what it was) cant occur in flight because once the servo is initialised then it's good, it's only that first initialisation that can sometimes fail. This failure generally happens on the first flight of the day or after the heli has been idle for a while. On my Trex 600 is happens on something like 1 in 10 first flights.
If you have experienced this then it's really important to do a pre flight check before every flight to make sure all servos are working. If it was this initialisation issue then it's nothing to do with the FBL, its entirely a BEC and servo compatibility thing. It could not explain the Goblin crash.
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Nade
Member
Yeah Smoggie, some of this has to do with personal preference as far as the set up is concerned. I’m not computer illiterate. I come from the days before windows, when there was just a C prompt on a black screen and do 99.o% of any of my needed computer repairs. So it was, at least in the beginning, exciting to get on to it and set up the fbl but over time it became cumbersome, mainly when it got to setting up, or should I say, trying to set up the bailout feature. Now I found I was in a new area, an area that I didn’t understand, talk of - gyro settings etc. Didn’t make any sense to me. Now it became complicated and since I’m a very analytical person if I can’t understand how and why something works the way it does its write up becomes jargon. So despite having fbls that have bailout they weren’t functional so it just became much easier to set my birds up with something like the AR7200. The one other fbl I have is the Bavarian Demon that is in the Bell 47GII. And despite the fact that it’s operating fine the bailout is not set up on that one either.
As far as a BEC the only bird I have that has one is the Bell 47, and that’s only because there wasn’t room on the bird to install it unless I stuck it outside somewhere. All my other birds, including the 600L has a separate primary battery. This allows me to work on the cyclic system without worrying about the main motor or blades. It also allows me to yes, test the fbl and servos to make sure all is functioning normally before I connect the main motor. That’s how I found out there was no response of the servos on my 600L the first time it failed to connect with the TX.
It is strange that you have rock solid performance from your spirit pros yet my two failed with the same symptom characteristics despite having different set ups. It’s too bad we’re so far apart as it sounds like you have a considerable amount to offer. If we were able to have worked on them together the root cause would most likely have been found. The only thing, to me, that is evident is the what but not the why. Thanks for your input Smoggie!
As far as a BEC the only bird I have that has one is the Bell 47, and that’s only because there wasn’t room on the bird to install it unless I stuck it outside somewhere. All my other birds, including the 600L has a separate primary battery. This allows me to work on the cyclic system without worrying about the main motor or blades. It also allows me to yes, test the fbl and servos to make sure all is functioning normally before I connect the main motor. That’s how I found out there was no response of the servos on my 600L the first time it failed to connect with the TX.
It is strange that you have rock solid performance from your spirit pros yet my two failed with the same symptom characteristics despite having different set ups. It’s too bad we’re so far apart as it sounds like you have a considerable amount to offer. If we were able to have worked on them together the root cause would most likely have been found. The only thing, to me, that is evident is the what but not the why. Thanks for your input Smoggie!