600 Goblin 570 KSE 6s vs 12s

USAF_Ret

Member
I am contemplating acquiring a Goblin 570 KSE and am pondering the motor / battery options and would like to get folks recommendations or how they currently have theirs setup.

So what are folks using and how do they like their setups?

The battery options for 6s are pretty straight forward but the 12s option seems to have a wider motor (kv) battery (mah) range (2600 - 3300 mah). I would also be interested in what brands of motors (kv) and size (mah) that folks are running and what are typical flight times for both the 6s and 12s options.

Are there any upgrade options that you would recommend?

I already fly a Trex 550L , so have a set of 4, 6s, 5000 mah batteries, so from the cost side, going with the 6s setup, seems to be slightly less cost regarding batteries and don't currently have a 12s setup, but have read that there is less motor bog with the 12s setup. I don't currently fly hard 3D, but am learning and don't want to have to replace the motor and get new batteries too as I advance.

I plan on running the IKON 2 for the gyro, if that has any bearing on topic.

Look forward to your opinions and recommendations.

Paul
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Uri ( Muranker) is probably the best one to advise as he has a 570, but from my experience of other helis around this size, it's right on the limit of what you can get away with for hard flying on 6S. For sports flying and moderate 3D I'm sure it will be fine on your existing 6S 5000mAh batteries, but for very hard flying I think 12S would be an advantage. If it's enough of an advantage to justify the expense of bying new batteries is your call.

Personally if going the 12S route and for aggressive flying i'd keep my batteries toward the smaller end of the range you mention to keep the weight in check.
 

USAF_Ret

Member
Uri ( Muranker) is probably the best one to advise as he has a 570, but from my experience of other helis around this size, it's right on the limit of what you can get away with for hard flying on 6S. For sports flying and moderate 3D I'm sure it will be fine on your existing 6S 5000mAh batteries, but for very hard flying I think 12S would be an advantage. If it's enough of an advantage to justify the expense of bying new batteries is your call.

Personally if going the 12S route and for aggressive flying i'd keep my batteries toward the smaller end of the range you mention to keep the weight in check.

Uri,

Thanks for the input.

Paul
 

murankar

Staff member
If you do the three blade head you have to go 12s. While this kit will fly a 6S 5500 pack, the kit will work the pack on 2 blades.

My setup is 12S and zI run 2 sticks at 3000 mAh and 1 stick at 3300 mAh. With the three blade go with the 3300 mAh. My motor is the Scorpion HK 4025-550 (For Goblin 570). My ESC is the Hobbywing 100 Amp HV, I am not sure if you will need the 120A HV. SInce I am cl,ose to leaving for work I can not post any flight logs right now. If I remember I will post them tonight. If you go HV on the ESC you will need either an external BEC or a flight pack. If you can find a way to mount an External BEC go for it. I use a flight pack.


If you have a Goblin then you know the challenges that goes with the kit. While its a great kit it still has its challanges. One thing to remember that no matter how hard you fly the three blade head is going to be harder on the system and flight times are going to be reduced.

Even with all that I would love to go three blade just so I can try it, but I am just as happy to keep the two blade.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Paul,
On the subject of ESC's.. I'm sure 100A would be fine if running a HV setup. The G570KSE manual recommends HV ESC's in the range 80A to 120A for 'hard 3D' use. The same manual does also list 6S as being suitable for 'general and 3D' flying, but you would need a larger amp rating ESC for 6S.

Hobbywing are my current favourite ESC. The new 'V4' ESC's all have a really good built in BEC. The Platinum 120A V4 would be ideal for a 6S setup. There is a bit of a gap in the HV V4 range, as it only starts at 130A which would be overkill, but it's still a very good ESC.
 

murankar

Staff member
While you can run it on 6s doesn't mean you should. It's going to be really hard on those packs. The 2 blade is hard enough on the pack as it is.

If your trying to keep the weight down on 12s then go with 3000 mAh 35c packs, a YGE ESC and a Kontronic Pyro motor (if I remember correctly for lighter motor).

My kit with 45c 3000 mAh packs and a opti-guard is right at 8 pounds. If I went 6s and lightest options I think the final all up is around 7 pounds.
 

USAF_Ret

Member
Smoogie / Uri,

Great input and advice.

I am not familiar with the Hobbywing ESC but have heard the are good. I am currently running Castles in all my helis now and was thinking of using the Castle Creations Phoenix Edge 130 which comes with a built in 5A BEC.

Paul
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
5A BEC isn't enough for a heli of this size. If you want to stick with Castle and use an internal BEC then the Talon range is what you want to look at, they have a 20A BEC.
 

murankar

Staff member
The 130 is going to be over kill. The Castle BEC pro is closer to what you want. If I had been thinking about it last year I would have gotten the Castle pro over flight pack. I use an 1850 2s rx pack. I get about 7 to 8 flights out of it. As stated earlier I also use the Opti guard as my safety net.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
The 130 is going to be over kill.

The Castle Edge 130A is an LV ESC (8S max), so this must be a 6S setup that Paul has in mind. That being the case 130A not really overkill because for the same power a 6S setup pulls twice as many amps as a 12S system. It's the BEC in the Edge 130 that concerns me, 5A isnt enough. If going with a 6S setup the Hobbywing Platinum 120A V4 is what i'd go for as it has a very powerful internal BEC which keeps the installation neat and tidy, but using an external BEC such as the Castle BEC pro is another option.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Uri, yes that's an option worth considering for sure, it has the same BEC as the 120A so that part of the equation would be fine.
Bear in mind though that the 100A is a 'V3' type ESC. It's still a nice ESC but it doesn't have the advanced features of the 120A V4. The biggest difference is that the V4 ESCs have active freewheeling, which is more efficient so you get a cooler running ESC and a little longer flight time. The extra 20A power rating would be handy on 6S too because 6S pulls double the amps compared to 12S (assuming similar headspeed for both). The 100A is a lot cheaper though!
 

murankar

Staff member
Active freewheeling is for large spans of duty cycles. If your using a governor then your not going to see large spans of duty cycles.

Now if your running a v curve then you will want to run active freewheeling. When you hit the lower v you will be changing the duty cycles.

I thought the same thing about active freewheeling. I thought I needed it. To be honest with any governor setup you don't need it.
 

Smoggie

Well-Known Member
Uri,

Active freewheeling is very useful for governor function, especially if you are governing in the lower end of the range. Although with governor the headspeed is constant the throttle opening (and hence duty cycle) is constantly changing according to load.
I did a back to back comparison on my Dune 600 (which I fly with governor like all my helis) between active freewheel on and off . There was a noticeable difference in flight time/battery depletion. It wasn't a huge difference but was noticeable and consistent, about 20 seconds. This is the main reason that I always try to select an ESC that has active freewheeling these days.

Hobbywing make exactly this claim on their web site, which I was sceptical about, that's why I did the test. I was surprised that the difference was so noticeable.
 
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